Sunday, July 1, 2018

Topix thread 06152015 posts 221 to 290

Annie
#290 Nov 27, 2012
How about "NoMoreFeralKittens DOT com
Barbara in Orlando
#291 Nov 28, 2012
James - if your target audience is people outside of the TNR /rescue world, I wouldn't use "feral" in the domain name since 90% of people either don't know the term or have a negative association with it.

FYI, after a post I read on another blog about the FDA being responsible for Feralstat being off the market I searched the FDA website, both regular and veterinary drugs and recalls,voluntary withdrawals, and safety alerts and there was nothing at all for "Feralstat".

I also read through the FDA guidelines for veterinarians as far as prescribing human drugs to animals, and they're given pretty wide latitude.

As far as the trademark, John Caltabiano is listed as "registrant" but I didn't check to see how the registrant passing away affects the trademark status.

My two cents - after advocating for humane treatment of feral cats here in Florida for years and coming up against a few well connected cat haters whose life goal seems to be keeping catch-and-kill the method of choice for "controlling" feral cats through animal control, it doesn't surprise me when anyone walks away from public endorsement of TNR/feral birth control. These people are vicious and tireless.
James
#292 Nov 28, 2012
Barabara, you are right about the majority of the public not knowing what the word "feral" means.
After I made my post above about the domain having the word "feralstat" in theDOT com site, I began to wonder about myself about trademark infringement...probably best the word "feralstat" be left out of the domain name.

I too have run up against the cat-haters and know exactly what you mean about that.

I myself too do not think that Feralstat was pulled because of FDA...if it had been, there would be record of it on the web somewhere. The ones that keep saying the FDA pulled Feralstat can't ever offer one shred of evidence to support that. Even some veterinarians erroneously report this as well, a perfect example was the post I posted here a few months ago about those vets that are on the payroll at one of those askDOTcom websites where a person asks a question and then pays the vet online when they answer it--lots & lots of erroneous information being "sold" to customers by these online vets when they ask about Feralstat. Not a single one of them ever quote this Topix thread or offer alternatives to their customers when asking about alternatives to Feralstat.

I think if there was a simple website setup with a condensed version of what we all have found out here on our own about a safe alternative to Feralstat, more & more unwanted litters would be prevented, plus the public and vets themselves would be more educated about feline contraception.

My friend has offered to set up a simple website for this purpose and I will supply him with the condensed & correct methods/info of mixing and dosing the MA, thus the public would not have to wade thru this now 2-yr old Topix thread for info on Feralstat alternatives.

Last weekend, I visited a large business and the employees there had "adopted" a small colony of feral cats on the premises..all employees feed them daily and they are trying their best to TNR the colony, but they can't get ahead of the game. I told them about MA and this thread...they are now in process of buying MA and mixing themselves until they can TNR the whole colony. The employees had no idea a feline contraceptive existed and neither did their vet (supposedly).

Keep suggesting domain names folks....I'll keep you posted..

James
Barbara in Orlando
#293 Nov 28, 2012
I think the site is a great idea. Anything that can be done should be done to spread the word that we finally have an edible birth control for cats. Especially since it looks as if this is going to have to be a grassroots movement since the large groups can't/won't endorse it.

If you need it, I copied all but the last couple posts from this thread that discussed dosage and where to get MA in to a Word doc.

As far as a name - what about catbirthcontrol dot com.

Barbara
Judged:
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James
#294 Nov 28, 2012
What about:

BirthControlForCats DOT com ?

Easy to remember and spell...

James
Judged:
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BusyBee
#295 Nov 28, 2012
James wrote:
What about:
BirthControlForCats DOT com ?
Easy to remember and spell...
James
I like your idea and also "Barbara in Orlando" suggestion of CatBirthControl dot com
BirthControl4Cats dot com (yours in another way :)

Did you get my email, James?
James
#296 Nov 28, 2012
Busy Bee, I like your suggestion as well. Yes, I did get your email...you should have received a reply by now..if not, email me back & I will resend it.

James
James
#297 Nov 28, 2012
Barbara in Orlando: Another good suggestion you have there for a domain name...I may just see if my friend will register two names and point the DNS settings to one site, that way we can be covered with two easy to remember names...after a few more suggestions for domain names, then maybe we can all decide and I'll send the domain names to my friend and let him register itwith domain services and then he can work on getting a web site up & running.

The MS Word document would be great to have with all the dosages listed. I can PDF it with Acrobat Pro X and people visiting the site would have access to a PDF as well as MS Word documents.

Last night while researching more on megestrol acetate for feline contraception, I ran across some foreign websites that referred to a drug known as "Megecat"...turns out this is a feline contraceptive prescribed by vets in other countries such as Belgium, Switzerland, etc. I haven't researched much more on the dosages, but it seems like it has been used for some time in other countries. I wonder why so many vets here in USA are unaware of MA in felines for contraception?? Hmm...just strengthens my hypothesis that there is too much $$$ involved in feline contraception here in the USA and the drug companies can't patent MA, thus we have to wait years & years for ACCD and FDA and drug companies to bring AFFORDABLE contraceptives for cats and dogs to market, if they ever do.

Barbara, you hit the nail on the head when you said this is turning into a grassroots effort. I'm glad we all stuck with this for the sake of the kitties as well as the caretakers.

I'm sure when the website goes up there will be all the naysayers and hate mail coming in from all over...I'm sure it will be bombarded...I know that is a "given"...I'm just surprised this thread itself has stayed so "clean" and not hijacked by the naysayers.

When I read your post Barbara, it reminded me of this quote: "Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world; indeed it's the only thing that ever has." -Margaret Mead

I'll keep you all posted on progress of the website as other suggestions come in.

James
JKPC
#298 Dec 10, 2012
Where can I get megestrol acetate/feralstat or ovaban?
Do I have to involve a vet?(Not likely here.)
The neighborhood is being over run by ferals. It is not feasible or affordable to trap & neuter all of the cats. Esp. with no help from neighbors or rescue groups. THANKS for any information you can provide.
http://64.13.129.136/pics/up-6VQUOLNIJI77CO2M-m
Since: Oct 12
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#299 Dec 10, 2012
You can google to find megestrol acetate on non-prescription foreign sites. Any MA strength will do. You would just have to break it down for the dosing protocol you choose. I've seen 2 so far, but have not read the entire site right here. Because only small amounts would be ordered, the product comes into the country relatively smoothly. What we would use for cats is not enough to make customs think we are setting up a resale operation.
Barbara in Orlando
#300 Dec 10, 2012
James - I emailed you the Word doc. with the MA dosage discussions from this forum - please let me know if you don't get it. Sorry about the delay - for some reason I don't get all notifications of new postings and just got one today.

As far as Megecat, that's interesting and not surprising. When I was searching PubMed for MA studies I noticed that vets outside the US often offered the full text of their studies for free on-line where very few if any studies from US vets were available in full. It's all very discouraging.

Thanks for the inspirational quote.
James
#301 Dec 10, 2012
I got it Barbara...I have replied via email to you.
Thank you so much!

Website will be up soon--may just be after Christmas though.

James
Debbie
United States
#302 Dec 12, 2012
So where can this product be purchased. I have several kittens this year. More than last year. ANd I would love to help keep this from happening. Too many cats that aren't wanted.
Debbie in Texas
United States
#303 Dec 12, 2012
I would love to find this product or anything like it. Any help anyone can give would be greatly appreciated.
Barbara in Orlando
#304 Dec 12, 2012
Did you read posting # 260 ? Excellent info. about approaching a vet about prescribing MA. My first request was a "no" (and he charged me for the visit) but that was a learning experience and I'll keep trying.

#269 and #299 mention ordering from foreign sources.
JKPC wrote:
Where can I get megestrol acetate/feralstat or ovaban?
Do I have to involve a vet?(Not likely here.)
The neighborhood is being over run by ferals. It is not feasible or affordable to trap & neuter all of the cats. Esp. with no help from neighbors or rescue groups. THANKS for any information you can provide.
steveh
#305 Dec 12, 2012
Barbara, Did the money grubbing bastard even give you a reason why. You should have told him to put his/her bill "where the sun don't shine"!!!! Please post his name & address - I'll be glad to contact him & it won't be to wish him/her a Merry Christmas. Good luck in finding a vet willing to write you a perscription - they're out there so don't give up. Steve
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Since: Dec 12
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SoCAL
#306 Dec 12, 2012
Thanks for your responses to my inquiry!
I have a the head of feral rescue group (affiliated with a local shelter which the group influenced to become a no-kill) coming tomorrow to do a mass trapping for TNR.
I met with her today when she delivered a new large group trap & asked why they weren't using "the pill for cats". She was unaware of MA/Feralstat and asked why it wasn't mainstream. I said I imagined it had to do with FDA. She also expressed concerns about side affects. I said if we woman can use a pill why can't cats? How bad would it be for a male to get a low dose?(We LOL about that & agreed the world might be a more peaceful place - no offense to you guys intended, really).
After cries for help to many rescue groups over several years, I was directed to this local group as they are affiliated in their TNR program with Best Friends in Kanab, UT. Being new to this thread, there is lots of reading to get to the important facts.
Would one of you who has participated in this thread over the years please post the important facts in summary form so I can print and give to this woman? She is a successful, high profile business woman here in SoCA & is committed to improving the quality of life for "community"/feral cats and she has contacts with Best Friends. She possibly could be a tremendous help to the kitty birth control movement.
THANK YOU!
Tell me when this thread is updated:
  
Topix › Medicine › FeralStat contraceptive: ACCD statement
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There are 332 comments on the Feral Cats in the News story from Jul 29, 2008, titled FeralStat contraceptive: ACCD statement. In it, Feral Cats in the News reports that:
Thursday, July 24, 2008 FeralStat contraceptive: ACCD statement AnimalResources early requested a statement about FeralStat from leading feral cat and nonsurgical sterilization veterinarians and the Alliance ...
Join the discussion below, or Read more at Feral Cats in the News.
   
COMMENTS
221 - 240 of 332 Comments Last updated Thursday May 28
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 of 17

Karen
#240 Jun 14, 2012
James, I somehow stumbled upon this site via Google.
James
United States
#241 Jun 15, 2012
Karen, what brands of spot-on have you tried on your kitties? There are cheap ones & expensive ones, made by companies such as Hartz, Seargents, Frontline (Merial), Advantage (Bayer), Zodiac, Bio-Spot, etc. They all contain different or similar active ingredients. Like humans reacting to medicinesdifferently, some cats react to these topicals different too. In plain terms, these are all topical insecticides, with the exception of Revolution, which is a drug (selamectin) & must be obtained by a vet RX.
All others are available OTC & sold in every store from dollar stores to grocery stores.

I myself prefer Frontline Plus & Advantage. I've never found MA to be a flea killer or repellant, & I gave up on herbal flea remedies years ago because they just didn't seem to work on my kitties.

Rather than doctoring the cats directly with topicals, you may have much better luck doctoring the cat's habitat--your yard, home, pet bedding etc with the same type insecticides found in Frontline or Advantage. If you are interested in this method, let me know & I can tell you what chemicals you can use DIY in your yard & home that mimic Frontline or Advantage and best of all, cost a LOT less than a dose of either.

Please post what spot-on you tried that bothered your kitties & we'll go from there...
But again,I've never seen any evidence that MA was effective on fleas & ticks.

James
Karen
#242 Jun 17, 2012
James, I use BioSpot at half the dose as directed. We do use yard/foundation spray for fleas, and use Enforcer to spray their bedding and mop boards/molding along the floor, rugs at entrances into the house.

The reason I believe MA is a flea killer/repellant: Last summer, at the farm where we feed the barn cats/ferals, they have 3 housecats and 2 dogs and they had a horrible outbreak of fleas in their house pets. I've never seen so many fleas on an animal. When I dipped their cats the water turned to blood from all the flea poop on them. The barns cat/ferals had ALWAYS had fleas and lice (the 2 cats that we are able to handle we would dip in the summertime). This past summer, when their house pets got infested so horribly, of course they blamed the barn animals. The 2 that we are able to handle we dipped and there was not 1 flea on them, many lice but not 1 flea. It had to be the MA.
James
United States
#243 Jun 19, 2012
Karen, that has me stumped---can't figure out why the ferals would not have fleas as I've never heard of MA being a repellant, but I guess it is possible.
I'll do some more research and let you know.

James
Anonymous
#244 Jun 19, 2012
Can someone give me a name & number of a vet that would not care if I used it to get MA. I just got rid of the last bunch of kittens that happened after the feralstat was taken off the market. I don't want that to happen again. It happened so fast I didn't have time to get anything. I cannot find a vet. I was really luckey to find home for the kittens, there were seven of them. I just can't afford to feed that many more.I had talked to Jamie or Jannie before all this happened. Ginger
James
United States
#245 Jun 21, 2012
Ginger, email me off list at the email addy below, substituting "@" & "." for the words:

ftaboxerATyahooDOT.com

James
Anonymous
#246 Jun 21, 2012
I am so sorry but it won't work.
James
#247 Jun 21, 2012
Ginger, just send an email to ftaboxer and place the @ symbol after the word boxer instead of the word AT, then the suffix is standard yahooDOTcom

Just substitute a . for the word DOT and all is fine.

ftaboxerATyahooDOTcom

I don't understand what you mean when you say it won't work--does the email bounce? If so, then you aren't spelling it properly--just follow standard email address protocol and all is fine.

James

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leslie leavitt
#248 Jun 23, 2012
Has anyone ever thought about going to change.org and starting a petition to get FeralStat back on the market?
Barbara in Orlando
#249 Jun 23, 2012
Karen and James - your discussion about fleas is so timely - I'm having a hell of a time with my cats and dog. Having to re-dose the dog after a week sometimes with the Advantage. Ironically, the one cat that insists on being outside 100% of the time doesn't seem to be that plagued by fleas - maybe it's not the MA but some kind of a natural immunity they develop ?
James
#250 Jun 23, 2012
Barbara, I too have wondered if feral cats/colonies evolve to develop a natural immunity to fleas. I have seen colonies in the past that would not be flea-ridden, but like you, my 3 domestic indoor house cats would have a terrible time with them.

Fleas are bad this year, but so far I have nipped them in the bud with my prevention methods both indoors & outdoors.

I treated my entire yard with imidacloprid, the same active ingredient in Advantage, doing it this way is much cheaper than buying Advantage for the pets.

Have also treated my yard and the feral colony's uptown alley area with it as well. In the past I have also used a fipronil based spray (same ingredient as in Frontline) since I could not directly dose the ferals with Frontline or Advantage.

James
Karen
#251 Jun 27, 2012
Barbara and James, regarding fleas -- I'm still leaning toward the MA because prior to its use any barn cat that we were able to handle we dipped because they were soooo flea/lice-ridden. The lice are still a big problem in the barn, but not fleas. We have been feeding the barn cats, along with their feral friends, for 15+ years. I am thinking it takes a full year of MA use to see the benefit against the flea.
Barbara in Orlando
#252 Jun 27, 2012
Karen - that's really amazing. Thanks for sharing. One more reason MA needs to be in canned food in every Petsmart.(I can dream, can't I ?)

James - I'm kind of caught because I'm in a condo complex where they don't treat the dog walk for fleas. I've considered doing it myself under dark of night - do you know if there's anything in imidacloprid that would be harmful to animals if one wandered through just after treatment ?
James
#253 Jun 27, 2012
Barbara, imidacloprid is the same active ingredient found in Advantage topical spot-ons for fleas in dogs and cats. Advantage contains 9.1% imidacloprid.

The "old" Advantage was only adulticidal and did not kill flea larvae and eggs, unlike Frontline which contains fipronil and (S) methoprene which targets larvicidal and ovicidal stages of the fleas--larvae & eggs respectively.

The fipronil in Frontline kills fleas, and the (S) methoprene kills the larvae & eggs.(S) methoprene is an "IGR" (insect growth regulator).

The Bayer company that markets Advantage, in a move to catch up with Merial that markets Frontline, came up with "Advantage II" for dogs and cats. The "new" Advantage II contains imdacloprid and Pyriproxyfen--the pyriproxyfen is a new "IGR" to kill flea larvae and eggs.

Again, the amount of imidacloprid in each vial of Advantage (new & II) is 9.1%.

To make a yard spray to mimic Advantage without actually doctoring the cat or dogs, you can make up your own solution of "generic" Advantage--a yard spray sort of.

The Bayer company holds the patent on imidacloprid. They also allow other pest control products to use imidacloprid in their formulations.

Bayer makes a fly spray for barns & stables called "QuickBayt" which contains 10% imidacloprid, slightly higher than the 9.1% imidacloproid found in Advantage old & II.

You can buy QuickBayt at a large feed store--about $11 for a bottle. The bottle is a spray type bottle (like what Windex comes in). The QuickBayt bottle contains only the dry powder mix of imidacloprid as well as a sugar attractant for flies (0.1% tricosene).

You buy the QuickBayt bottle of powder and fill it up with water to make a fly spray for barns and stables.

What you want to do is buy a bottle of QuickBayt and pour the powder into a small 1 or 2 gallon pump-up sprayer and then fill with water. You now have effectively mixed a diluted form of Advantage with imidacloprid as the active ingredient.

Now just pump up the sprayer and spray your yard, dog run, or whatever with the fly spray mixture.

Again, remember that imidacloprid only kills the adult fleas--not the larvae & eggs. If you want to go one step further and mimic the larvicidal and ovicidal effects of Advantage II, then you can buy a small bottle of "Precor", which is an IGR to kill flea eggs and larvae.

A small bottle of Precor IGR is also available at feed stores as well and is sold as a DIY pest control product to be added to flea sprays for home and yard.

A small bottle of Precor IGR will run you about $10 as well. Mix the Precor with the QuickBayt in the pump sprayer and spray the target area. The imidacloprid is residual and will kill adult fleas for weeks and weeks--the Precor will kill the eggs & larvae.

A $20 investment in QuickBayt & Precor & mixed in a pump up sprayer goes a LOT further than a $40.00 pack of Advantage that contain only a few CCs of product.

Again, just spray the area the dogs & cats run in and all is fine. The QuickBayt is made for barns & animal quarters so it is safe around animals.

You could do a stealth spraying of the dog run in your condo at night and the area will be flea-free for weeks and weeks...plus flies will eliminated as well since QuickBayt is marketed as a fly insecticide.

James
Penny
#254 Jun 30, 2012
I had been using feral stat on my feral colonies...till i could not longer get it. What a pity...now i am having to deal with litters of kittens. Feral stat worked. I cannot trap all these cats ...some were caught...some were too smart to trap. Now i am feeding even more cats/kittens with no end in sight. These cats have no home and no one wants them. I am willing to take the risk of feral stat...there are just toooooo many for me to deal with.
Bert
#255 Jun 30, 2012
I've been rescuing cats (and some dogs) for over 10 years. I am now broke because of it.

First, regarding FeralStat: I find it hard to understand the so-called concern for potential side effects of the product. Are they really worse than the "side effects" of overpopulation? FeralStat was making it possible for one person to manage ferals affordably, whereas trap-neuter-return is labor intensive, very costly, and no assurance of catching every individual. So it's better to let them multiply to overcrowding, leading to starvation, fighting, disease, and wholesale death? What makes anyone think they would live longer under those conditions anyway? Shame on the veterinary medical industry for forcing suffering under terrible conditions when another option exists. And here's a wake-up: amazingly, not all veterinarians care. In our rural area, vets are livestock oriented. Cats are just a bother. Dogs are less so, as long as they are "cattle dogs." I've had no success in implementng any spay/neuter programs. Oh, I can bring them in for the surgery, and I have (they do not object to the extra income!), but then animal control runs routine trap-and-kill sessions anyway, not to mention what the farmers do. I've rescued many that were injured from a bad aim, legs caught in steel jaw traps, or just plain skinny/hungry and pest-infested. If the colonies could be limited, perhaps all these people wouldn't get so worked up about culling.

Second issue: fleas, etc. Speaking of side effects and over-chemicalizing our animals, there are natural options that are no more expensive than the consumer products. I refer you to 
www.cedarcidestore.com . I just started using the product called Best Yet in a spray bottle. One quart for $30. It smells bad, but it keeps the flies off my dogs' ears, kills adult fleas, ticks, ear mites, and any other 6- or 8-legged pest. This stuff is so safe, you could get it on your food and it wouldn't hurt you. Yuck, but hey... you can use it wherever you're having a picnic or BBQ and everyone will be fine, including the kids. Take it camping or boating...use it on yourself, not just the pets. And no, I don't get a commission for mentioning them. They don't even have an affiliate program. But you can buy a "portable store" from them and carry it around selling the stuff. Like I have time...
linda
#256 Jul 17, 2012
I am ordering from the link you provided for megestrol acetate. Now, I need to know how much and how often to sprinkle of food. About 8 feral cats in colony.
James
#257 Jul 17, 2012
Linda, the information you ask has been covered in this thread thoroughly just a few posts back. Please, please before anyone starts dosing colonies with MA, be sure you understand the correct dosage and how to mix it. The best way as we have all said is by making a liquid suspension out of two pills.

Out of respect for everyone here that has stuck with this thread and put so much time and effort here working out dosings and researching side effects, please go back and read the posts that so many have researched here. Then if you do not understand the dosing, then we all will be glad to help.

Again, the information you seek is just a few posts back. I have posted the dosage charts & frequency several times in the past few weeks. The information is also posted on 
Fairchildcat.org as well.

James
yerlo
#258 Aug 16, 2012
julie wrote:
It's Sept 8, 2011. I have one week of Feral Stat left and I have 60 cats on it. Can you imagine what can happen with that many once it is used up? I must find out what's going on, so is there any updates?
Also, when folks talk about side effects....read carefully, there are none to speak of. It states these things can happen in LARGE doses. Also, how does one supposed "expert" really know. Heck, vet "experts" do not even know about the miracle cure apple cider vinegar for cats and even newborn kittens.
I have used Feral Stat since 2009 with no problems and no kittens. jaws6418@gmail.com
What is that apple cider miracle cure? What does it cure and how is it used?
BusyBee
#259 Sep 7, 2012
Kathryn41 wrote:
I would think that most colonies wouldn't have a problem with left over medicated food. The amount given is so small that you try to concentrate it enough in the wet food that then gets eaten up.
My colony gets medicated food on Tuesday mornings between 6:30 and 7 am. I use one large can of catfood to mix in the megestrol. There are 11 serving dishes for food. I put their dry food down first then each dish gets a glop (about a tablespoon) of medicated food on top. The cats start to eat the medicated food right away and finish that before they eat the dry food. I take note of who is there and eating and watch to make sure all of them actually do eat. They run around from dish to dish, alert and on guard to any movement outside of the area. Once I see that all have eaten some medicated food I leave them to finish. I go back around lunch time to 'check'. There may be some dried food left but there is never any of the medicated food left. There wouldn't be any wildlife around during the day that would get to any medicated food that is left out. There are opossums, raccoons,fox, coyote and birds in the area. I do know that the birds sometimes finish up any dry food that is left but the mammals don't come out during the day so I think with careful management it is unlikely that wildlife would get any of the food. The only problem I might have is if a neighbourhood dog gets loose - they aren't allowed to be loose here - and accidentally stumbles on the dishes before the cats finish them. It hasn't happened yet but I guess it is always a possibility.
Kathryn41~I live near Atlanta GA, can you tell me where you get your cat birth control.
Thanks.

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